“Eradicating Bible Poverty”

00:01
Mark Green
We just said, let’s come together. What could we do together in unity, in oneness that we couldn’t do by ourselves? The big goal was to eradicate Bible poverty. 

00:21
Rich Rudowske
Welcome to the essentially translatable podcast brought to you by Lutheran Bible translator others I’m rich Friedowski. 

00:26
Emily Wilson
And I’m Emily Wilson. 

00:28
Rich Rudowske
As we get ready for today’s episode, Emily, two words for you. Hobby Lobby. 

00:32
Emily Wilson
I love Hobby Lobby. It’s magical. 

00:35
Rich Rudowske
It is a magical place. My wife, as you know, is big into crafts. And so hobby Lobby is a place that we have been from time to time. In fact, we met at a summer camp and she was the crafts director and I was the guy who ditched his cabin and skipped arts and crafts until she called me out on it, thus beginning our wonderful relationship all these years later. But we’ve had our share of time at Hobby Lobby and it is really a unique place. 

01:02
Emily Wilson
I love it. Yeah, I spent quite a bit of time growing up there and yeah, skills with flower arrangements or school supplies or crafts and projects, always group projects. But I’ve really enjoyed too over the years watching how they use their faith as an opportunity to be able to share that too with people who wouldn’t otherwise have exposure to the church. Maybe they’re just in for craft supplies, but they’re able to see scriptural merchandise and things like that. It’s just really exciting. 

01:37
Mark Green
Yeah. 

01:38
Rich Rudowske
And one of the folks that is responsible for that ethos is a guy named Mark Green, who we’re going to talk to a little bit. And Mark is a champion for Bible translation. And we’re going to talk with him. He’s going to talk some about return on investment and being a businessman and trying to mesh that with ministry. So it’s kind of an interesting approach and just a unique perspective on how folks think about their work in the gospel and how God uses gifting and skills from everybody in different ways. 

02:06
Emily Wilson
It’s true, yeah. That he has equipped each one of us with our own unique gifts and talents and how we can work together to just share his light and love with the world around us. 

02:18
Mark Green
Yeah. 

02:18
Rich Rudowske
So Mark Green is the ministry investment officer for Hobby Lobby and the founder of Mardell Christian Education Supply stores. He’s also a leading champion of illuminations, a collective impact alliance working to eradicate Bible poverty by 2033. So sit back, enjoy the ride, and we are going to hear from Mark Green. We are glad to welcome Mark Green to the podcast today. Thanks for joining us this morning. 

02:44
Mark Green
Thank you. Rich. Emily, looking forward today and excited to talk about translation. 

02:50
Emily Wilson
So, Mark, can you share a little bit with us about your background and how you have started with the hobby lobby stores and then even further into that, what your role is and what you do for the company now? 

03:04
Mark Green
Yeah, it was an interesting childhood for me, actually. My father was in the retail business. He’s a PK, a preacher’s kid. And his mom and dad, my grandparents, wanted preachers, and so he had five siblings and they got five out of six. His preacher and missionary was the ultimate. And everything else was kind of whatever. My dad felt a little second class, actually, but he just actually didn’t do real well in school, so he went and worked in the retail business just being a stockboy. And then my mom worked in the soda fountain. And so they got married at a young age, and he did very well in the retail business. But it got the point that he only got two days a month off. He got every other Sunday off. 

03:42
Mark Green
And so he was trying to line up his goals, which God, family and work. But it was kind of getting out of proportion and stuff like that. So in 1970, my dad went to the bankers and tried to borrow as much money as he could, and they gave him $600. And so for $600, he could buy a chopper, a machine that would cut wood and some sticks of wood to make frames. So in 1970, I was nine, my brother was seven. We started a company called Grico Green and Pico, and we’d glue frames. And we did that for two years, seven cents a frame. My dad kept his job, so my mom worked for free, and we got paid seven cents each as children. And then my mom picked us up after school and went down to cerebral palsy. 

04:22
Mark Green
And different ones with different situations could glue frames, and it was an income for them. So anyway, we did that for two years. In 1972, my dad finally opened the first little hobby lobby store, 600. 

04:34
Emily Wilson
Wow. 

04:34
Mark Green
We cut the frames in the back of the. It was a little house. We cut the frames in the back room, in the front room. We sold arts and crafts in the 1975, my dad finally quit his job. He was making 26,000 a year. Cut it down to 13,000 a year, go to work for himself and hobby Lobby. Started with two stores, then to three, and then today has 900 stores. And so that’s kind of my background, braided up retail. It was in our home. We moved the same. And then in 1981, I was 19. I quit school also. So we’re not good role models for school. We love school. And all four of my kids graduated first graduates, thank goodness, from college. And so I started what’s called Mardell, which is a christian bookstore, an educational store. 

05:16
Mark Green
And so I did that for 34 years, then about four or five years ago for succession planning reasons and all that. Now my role is a ministry investment officer, so I kind of coordinate and work with all of the giving that we give. And then about half of my life is spent actually in the translation world with illuminations, trying to make sure everybody on planet Earth has scripture in their heart language. 

05:37
Emily Wilson
Awesome. And thank you very much for all of your heart in hobby Lobby and Mardell, because that is such a blessing for millions of people who have been able to have a witness to scripture through the workers there at hobby Lobby, but also the things that you keep on your shelves. I mean, I’ve seen people who have exposure to scripture as they shop through the stores. Maybe they don’t know Christ. So that’s always exciting to see. 

06:08
Rich Rudowske
True. Yeah, they see that art on the wall in their friend’s home or that stuff, and it’s a great opportunity for. 

06:15
Mark Green
We’re always playing music, right? So those are little things that we can do to try to be. How do you be a living witness of who you are? 

06:23
Emily Wilson
Absolutely. 

06:24
Rich Rudowske
So since this podcast started, really, we always end up having to talk something about COVID because it’s just been such a thing. So tell us just a little bit about. Because it kind of helps folks know that you’re a real person trying to make stuff work just like everybody else. So when Covid first hit, how did that affect your life? And how did you process and work through that? 

06:45
Mark Green
Yeah, that’s been interesting for all of us, isn’t it? Instead of asking people, how are you doing? I ask them, what’d you learn during COVID Right. Hopefully learn something. Some bad stuff, some good stuff. But that’s a long story, rich. So I’m going to try to get it down know, and just give you the real highlight version. I call it the six O’s of COVID It was an unusual experience, but six weeks in a row, the Lord just put a different o word on my heart. Now, the first week I didn’t get it, because the first week I was skiing at breaking ridge and I was skiing with thousands of people, and the next day, all the ski lifts shut down. I didn’t know it, and I walked out. Where’d everybody go? Rapture happened or what? 

07:19
Mark Green
Because spring break and skiing, there are people, right? And there’s nobody. I mean, you’re like, what happened? And they’d shut it all down. We had 19 of my family members, my wife, our kids, our grandkids. We had 19 of our 21 gang there. And so I called that the oblivious time. My first girl was oblivious. I was oblivious. I went ahead and went on spring break, took a chance, and now I’m trying to get back home. And then it went to overwhelmed. The next o. My dad is nearly 80. He’ll be 80 this year. And on a phone call, unbeknownst to me, with all the officers of hobby Lobby asked me to be in charge of cash flow. And so I freaked out, right? Because I got 45,000 people on this boat, and I don’t know if we’re going and we’re in LA. 

07:58
Mark Green
I don’t know if we’re going to San Francisco. Are we going to Miami? Are we going to Hong Kong? Nobody can answer that question. All they said is, just don’t rent out gas. Now you got only so much gas. You got all these people, and how are we not in a crash? So, unfortunately, my faith was not as strong as I had hoped because I freaked out. It caused tension in myself, it caused tension in my own family and all that stuff. And so, thankfully, God was giving me a different o. Each week. These o’s I come in and out of, by the way. But the next one, and again, I won’t go into a whole story, but it was overcomer. I just knew God put in my spirit were going to be overcomers. 

08:33
Mark Green
Didn’t know what it’s going to look like, didn’t know how it was going to happen, because here we are. We got 900 stores and we’re shutting them down. So even in the middle of that, God gave me a sense of being an over. We’d be an overcomer. Then the next Saturday, it was the word onward. All of a sudden, I realized that we got this ship ready. We’re going to shut all the stores down, but we’re going to have to open ball back up. We got to get ready to go onward. And so we got to think about the future and all that. I have seven adventure partners, and so I was sending something to my seven adventure partners because, hey, I’m in over my head. I’m overwhelmed. You guys pray for me. 

09:03
Mark Green
These guys have been with me for almost 20 years now, and whenever I get in over my head, they’re there for me. So I sent out these four o’s and said, wow, the Lord’s putting these o’s on my mind. And one of my guys said, I know your next o. And I’m like, there are no nxt o’s. Onwards. The last o, you’re there. And he wrote this very nice paragraph, and he says, you will overachieve. And so I’m like, okay, I like that overachieve, but I don’t know what to do with it. I got to go back and get ready. And so I’m a runner. I’m training for half marathon. I have a goal to get a medal in my age group in the half marathon. So I go out on a Saturday. Wind is 22, windiest. 

09:40
Mark Green
I write down the wind, I know the humidity, I know everything every Saturday, because that’s my long runs. In three years, I’ve been just doing this intense training, and I’m off pace. And then, anyway, the Lord did several things and I wound up running. My best time ever going to happen. But in my spirit, it reminded me, my friend said, oh, you’re going to overachieve. And I thought, okay, I really would like to overachieve and work and Bible translation and other my family. But, hey, I’ll take this as a sign. And then the next Saturday, I was on a Zoom call at 04:00 on Saturday. Who’s on Zoom calls at 04:00 on Saturday? It was one of those deals. The last two speakers used the word one. I thought, well, that’s an old word, I don’t know. 

10:18
Mark Green
So to my wife, I said, well, maybe one is the word usually I get on Saturday morning. And I was done. Overachieve is good enough in one. And then with in 30 minutes, dick Eastman, a man of prayer and every home for Christ, sends me his email. And it’s got the word one in it seven times, four times in the verse he shared, and three other times I said, okay, lord, the word is one. So that’s kind of the six o’s of COVID for me and kind of the lessons I’ve learned, to be honest, I’ve rotated back around and stuff like that. But I feel like that for me, if we can come together as one, the church, we see a lot of darkness right now in Covid and all that stuff. Light cast out darkness. Darkness doesn’t cast out darkness. 

10:55
Mark Green
As Martin Luther King said, light does. So what happens when we as a church all come together? John 1721 tells us that then others will know who you are when we work together. And so I think the church will have an incredible opportunity in the days ahead to be a witness to a world. And we have the answers. And he’s the one. Jesus is the one. Right. And stuff. So one has lots of connotations for one unity, because it’s a word I use a lot, is unity. How do we unify? And then one, Jesus is the one. 

11:23
Rich Rudowske
Yeah, absolutely. There is a big opportunity for the church and the gospel to bring light. 

11:29
Emily Wilson
Absolutely. 

11:31
Rich Rudowske
Tell us about illuminations, the Illuminations movement a little bit. Our listeners may not know much about it. What is it, what its objective? 

11:40
Mark Green
Yeah, illuminations. There’s kind of a term out there. Stanford did some studies. They call it collective impact. You can make an impact isolated and do things, and we do, and there’s reasons to do that, but collective impacts, what could we do when we come together? And so illuminations is a collaboration between ten Bible translation agencies, Lutheran Bible translators among those, as well as nine others, really, which are connected to lots of other people. You got the United Bible societies, which really represent 150 Bible studies. They have the American Bible studies, but there’s the brazilian Bible study, there’s Bible studies in most of the countries of the world. So it’s the collaboration of that and so along with five resource partners. So about ten years ago, may of 2010, we just said, let’s come together. 

12:20
Mark Green
What could we do together in unity, in oneness that we couldn’t do by ourselves. The big goal was to eradicate Bible poverty and make sure that all 6000 plus vital languages have God’s word in their heart language. And no organization by themselves could say they could eradicate biopoverty. There’s nobody could do that. But if we all came together, then together we could say, lutheran Bible translators can say, we are part of eradicating Bible poverty with our partners. And so that’s what illumination’s goal is. And it’s been exciting these last ten years. We’ve met with the ceos and five resource partners 102 times. Now we met in person. Typically, we’d fly into the Dallas airport because everybody can get to Dallas. The largest animals club in the country is in Dallas at c 21. We would meet there for 4 hours. Fly in, fly out. 

13:07
Mark Green
Except last March was our last one. We met march the 10th. And since then we’ve had to do it by Zoom. And so I’m ready to get back together. And Zoom is great. I can see the people, but just touch the people, to be there, because these are comrades together. What we do is we all have good days and bad days. We all get overwhelmed. There’s other days we feel like overcomers, the O’s we talked about. But when you lock arms with the other people on the team. Then it just feels like, okay, when I’m down, you’re up. When you’re down, I’m up. And so how do we collaborate? How do we come together? And there’s strength in numbers, but Satan always attacks at the point of unity. And that’s why unity is so hard, is because the power is in unity. 

13:47
Mark Green
So anyway, that’s kind of what illuminations at a high level is all about, rich, right? 

13:53
Emily Wilson
Can you share with us a little bit about how you have this heart for Bible translation? Where did that start? And can you share a little bit about that? 

14:02
Mark Green
Yeah, I’d love to share that, Emily. Thanks for asking. That’s a favorite question for me. I have to go back to February the 7th, 1998. Actually, the fifth. I got on an airplane. I was flying down to Guatemala. And the reason I was going down there was for a Bible dedication. And so because we had christian bookstores and we tithed our profits, we thought, wouldn’t it be neat to help people get a Bible that they didn’t have? And I wasn’t aware of it, to be honest with you. I’m thinking there’s 200 countries, there’s 200 languages. Everybody’s got it. But I became aware that there weren’t. So we thought, oh, we’ll help pay for printing of translation. That’s something our employees get excited about. So they said, well, you’ve paid for these printings. Why don’t you come to a dedication? 

14:39
Mark Green
And it’s kind of like, okay, when can I do it? I have four kids I’m trying to raise. Okay, honey, when can I go? So finally it worked out. Guatemala. And so I’m on this plane and I don’t know much about it. And so they give me a sheet of paper and I’m reading about it. The eastern huckle tech people. There’s 30,000 eastern Huckle techs. There’s 8000 of them that can read. There’s 1000 believers. There’s 400 believers who can read. Now, I’m a business guy and I like Roi. Return on investment, right? I’ve just sent this money and you’re telling me only 400 people can read the Bible? You got to be kidding me. I’m assuming languages means millions of people. Those two go together in my brain. And so I’m already kind of depressed. 

15:14
Mark Green
And then I look and I see that it started in 1958. I’m going, oh, my gosh, 1958? I’m born in 1961. This couple’s been down there 40 years. Translating this Bible for 400 people. So I’m like, I have no idea how to console them. I just know I’m not doing this anymore. But I’m on the plane, we’re down there. Let’s go for this thing. So I get there, and I get out, and it’s Wycliffe that I’m with, and several Wycliffe employees are there, so they’re going to take me this dedication, and like, oh, okay. It’s eight hour bus ride. I didn’t know that. Obviously, it’s not in Guatemala City. We’re on this bus for 8 hours. It was a death defying trip, to be honest with you. 

15:49
Mark Green
There’s a couple of times I didn’t know if I told my wife I loved her and all my kids, like I should have, because I didn’t know if I’m coming back or not. We finally get there, and now we’re at this Bible ceremony, and so I’m just trying to get through it and hoping there’s a good story, because the family is going to want to know a good story when you get back. And I don’t know how to tell a good story with only 400 people. The ROI is not working. And then Gaspar, who is one of the locals, I mean, Dennis and Gene stratemy are from America. We’re in the process. But here’s Gaspar, an eastern hogletech. He was one of the translators, so that gave the Bible to him. 

16:23
Mark Green
They sell them to the people for whatever price is culturally relevant, but obviously, the ceremony, and they’ve got colors and all the pageantries and songs and all that going on. But now Gaspar goes forward to get his Bible, and he did something I’ve never seen before. In our christian bookstores, we actually have a thousand different types of bibles in English, right? We got colors, we got different versions, we got all that. And I’ve helped people find the one that they wanted, but they never did what Gaspar did. When Gaspar got his Bible, he wept, and I was stunned by that. He took his handkerchief out, and he wiped his know. In that moment, the Holy Spirit put a question in my heart, and that was, why don’t you go tell Gaspar? He’s not a good roi? 

17:07
Mark Green
And I’m like, oh, man, it’s like a spear going through my heart, right? Because I’ve been saying that for two days, they’re not a good roi. And now he’s weeping over that Bible. And so in one moment, I went from, why would Bible translators go do this for small people groups to how can we make sure everybody on planet earth has God’s word in their heart? Language. So it was a man that I’ve never been able to speak to who totally rocked my world. 

17:34
Emily Wilson
I love that story. It’s so powerful to see how God can transform our hearts and our minds and that it’s scripture and our impact and our relationship to God’s word that really can transform us. That’s awesome. 

17:53
Mark Green
Yeah. And what was interesting is it really changed me personally, because the next morning, February the eigth, I’m in a one dollars hotel, and I pay too much at that. But anyway, which was fine. I didn’t mind the hotel. I just didn’t like paying too much. And so we’re buyers, right? We pride ourselves on being merchants. And so at 02:00 in the morning, I couldn’t sleep. I mean, this was a barn, and it was freezing cold. And so I finally got up, and Kay Arthur, in her book, said, being in God’s word and known it for yourself is the key. And I know that I’m a Christian. I’m a fifth generation Christian. On my mom’s store, to my dad’s side, I’ll never miss Church. I own christian bookstores. I paid for a printing of a translation. I have 40 bibles. 

18:30
Mark Green
Me, I have 40 bibles. Not my kids. Me, I have 40 bibles. And yet I don’t read God’s word any kind of consistent basis. But because of gas bar on February 7, on February the eigth, at 02:00 in the morning, I made a vow that I get up first thing and read God’s word for the rest of my life. And so I was able to recently celebrate 23 years of being faithful to that. Not only did I see Gaspar be transformed, but gaspar transformed me. Because now I’m in the book and I say, this book is alive. I can say that confidently. It will speak to Gaspar. Any language you all want to translate it into, it will speak to the people. 

19:04
Emily Wilson
Yeah. God’s word is living and active, and that only by him can we be transformed. That’s awesome. 

19:11
Rich Rudowske
In the intervening years, then, you’ve kind of spun up this illuminations movement. Not yourself, of course, but God working through a whole bunch of people that starting to all get in the same stream and see the same vision. What are some of the things that you’ve seen that have resulted from that alliance in terms of accessibility to scripture and other progress, or things that you think are indicators that something’s happening here? 

19:36
Mark Green
Yeah, one of the first things we really started with was based on need. And one of the first thing was in 2010, the digital world was really starting to come on to us with iPhones, starting to do apps and all that stuff. So what was happening is we as a resource partner were being asked by a couple of different people and could predict more. Can you help us digitize these bible texts? Because the english was spanish, but there’s a lot of bibles that were not digitized, so they weren’t ready for the digital world. So you have people, you, version happens to be in the town where I live, they’re saying, hey, would you help us digitize these text cost about $1,500 a text. There’s over 2000 languages that are translated well. That adds up to a lot of money. 

20:14
Mark Green
Then you got the print on demand people saying, hey, green family, will you help us digitize this text? We’re like, well, we don’t want to do it twice. And why, if we do it for the ministry, will they share with others? Really? Let’s go back to lutheran bible translators, let’s go back to the different ones who have these texts and say, hey, could we come together and digitize these? So the first idea that we had really was what we call a Digital Bible library was a tool. So what if were to digitize the text of the world? 

20:39
Mark Green
We were to centralize them and to standardize them so that the print on demand, the you versions, and other people of the world would have one place to go, there’d be one standard and all that because we as donors didn’t want to build a digital bible library for lutheran bible translators and then build another one for all the 150 Bible size of the world and then another one for Wycliffe and all that. So it was just as a resource partner and it was good for the ministries and all of that. So I said, we want to digitize, centralize and standardize. But the big goal was to finalize. Right now we’ve built this library, it can hold all 6000 languages, but we’ve only got in round numbers about 2000 of them. Then we got another 2000 somebody’s working on and 2000 that nobody started. 

21:17
Mark Green
So that’s our goal. And so tools like that coming together. And then we had a big vision to eradicate Bible poverty. And what do we mean by that? The ultimate goal is that every tribe, every nation, every verse is current in the full scripture. But short term, we picked up what we called an all access goal, taking the resource partners and the ministries together, let’s come up with a goal that we could do. And we set a goal of 2033. So we said, well, how about if 95% of this world will have a full scripture? So our goal was that 95% of this world would have the full scripture, 99.96 would have at least a New Testament, and 100% of the people would have a full Bible. Now, if the numbers are right, in 2033, there will be 8.7 billion people. 

22:01
Mark Green
That means all but 3 million of them would have a New Testament, and 95% of those would have the full Bible. If we reach our goal now, it’s a faith goal, it’s a stretch goal. We also added that the top hundred languages, because there’s so many people in the top hundred languages, would have two translations. And then we set another goal, that those two would both be current, because some languages have two translations, but one of them is really old, so we want to get those. So we got all the agencies, okay, top hundred. Do we have two? No. Which language do we not have? Top hundred. Which ones need to be revised? Do that. And all the languages. 

22:33
Mark Green
And so getting all that data together and all that is also another thing that we’re doing to make sure where are the languages and all that stuff, because it’s. And I had no idea when we started it, I thought sign language was universal. There’s nearly 400 sign languages. Okay, well, our goal is impossible. Might as well throw that on top of our impossible goal. 

22:56
Emily Wilson
No. It’s so important to be able to have that perspective and to be able to see this is what we’re rallying behind, this idea of unity and how important it is, because it’s not just an aimless, like, okay, Lutheran Bible translators is doing this, but we don’t know. Left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing, but rather as the whole body working together, that we might be unified and being able to see that vision of God’s word in the hands and hearts of people around the world. And I love that you’re like, it’s an impossible goal, but with God, all things are possible. And just really, just very thankful for that partnership. 

23:40
Rich Rudowske
Yeah. And thinking of the data, part of it is just massive. And in my role, trying to look at those things, I mean, the impact of this alliance and just striving for a standard way to talk about things that are not standard. I mean, that’s the thing. And there’s so much nuance and ways to look at language and language situations, but to say, okay, we recognize all that, but let’s make an attempt to see what we can do to try to have a common language, to talk about languages and what’s happening where has been a significant objective and I think has the possibility to bear much fruit. I mean, certainly you have to know when you have an all access goal, you have to start to know specifics of exactly what we’re talking about in those things. 

24:24
Rich Rudowske
And the data work that’s being done by a lot of folks behind the scenes there too, is pretty important. So, thinking about the illuminations movement again, what’s like on the horizon right now, or what are you excited about for the movement right now? 

24:37
Mark Green
Yeah, I’m excited about several things. Obviously, the unity gets stronger and stronger. I think the data, as you talked about earlier, is getting stronger and stronger. We now know that the goal is 1,838,536 chapters. All right, we know what it is. We know that 899,917 are done and we got 938,619 to go. So it’s taken almost 2000 years and we’re halfway there, 15 years to get the other half. So that’s why it’s an impossible task. But with technology and collaboration and working together. So I think the data is getting very good. I think it’s exciting because I see resource partners that have come to the illuminations event. We have an event once a year where we bring in resource partners from all Lutheran Bible translators there, as well as resource partners and other people. 

25:22
Mark Green
We all come together and these givers have started giving about four times what they gave when they gave to an individual agency. We just seen that. So if they gave a certain dollar amount, many of these are six figure givers. So if they were given 100,000, they’re now given 400,000 because they see the collaboration and they’re business people, right? For the most part, they earned this money. They did something they love, seeing stewardship on both sides. Now, there’s a lot of hard work going on behind the scenes, and if they really understood how hard the translators were working, it would be even easier. But to know that the collaboration is happening and that two people aren’t, because some of us as donors have had that experience. Two organizations are asking us to fund the exact same translation. 

25:57
Mark Green
We’re like, oh, wow, plenty of them out there. Are we collaborating? Are we working together? So I think that’s very attractive. But we’re also now starting to go out and we’re going to do what’s called a twelve verse campaign. Because I want everybody my son doesn’t get invited to this illuminations celebration. Right. Because he’s not a six digit giver, but he could give $35 a month. Right. And so a verse costs $35. Approximate cost of a verse is $35. So this is a way that everybody can be a part of that. And so we’re starting to roll that out in churches. We’ve been working with some of the concert people and all that kind of stuff to get out there so everybody can be a part of Bible translation. Financially now, there’s lots of other ways. 

26:33
Mark Green
We need volunteers, we need prayer people and all that. So I’m super excited about expanding the horizon. There’s lots of people who have. I just think we’ll get hundreds of thousands of people that says, I want to be a part. I can do $35 once. I can do $35 a month and be a part of Bible translation at that level. 

26:50
Emily Wilson
It’s really exciting to be able to mobilize and again, having that unified spirit, that all of the church is to be involved and to build one another up. 

27:01
Mark Green
Yeah. And that’s what’s cool, is because you are illumination. Lutheran Bible translation is illumination. It’s not them and us, we’re all part of together. Elimination is not a separate organization. It’s not a 501. It’s just a collaboration of all coming together. So we all together can say, hey, we want to be a part of eradicating Bible poverty. And so it’s exciting, and there’s several ways people can be involved. And I think by getting people to give $35 a month, some of those will become hebrew and greek scholars and help do consultant check. And they will be people who go. They will be donors because they’ll say, I had no idea. I had no idea there was that many languages. And so obviously, that’s what we’re really excited about, too. 

27:36
Mark Green
By getting this out into more of the larger audiences, there will be people to say, here’s what I can do. I have time. I have talent that I can give. And so it’s exciting to see when people find out. Just like I didn’t know much about translation, so I saw a man weep over it. It’s exciting to see what can happen when people know. Yeah. 

27:54
Rich Rudowske
And one of the most frequently questions I get asked as a leader in one of the Bible translation organizations, when I go out and speak publicly or talk about this kind of work and what we’re doing, the most frequently asked question I get is, how are you coordinating with the other agencies? I mean, that’s what people are really interested in how are you coordinating with the other agencies. And illuminations gives me a tangible thing to point to and say through this alliance with these other agencies, we love to talk about Lutheran Bible translator stories, but we also point folks to illuminations Bible, that website, and anybody listening here, you could go look that up and see sort of our alliance expression of the Bible translation work. And again, a lot of folks find that really meaningful. 

28:40
Rich Rudowske
I think it’s a great impulse within the christian church that by and large, most folks say the task is massive. The task to share the gospel is massive, and there’s no reason there should be competition in any way in it. And so they love to see that collaboration. 

28:56
Mark Green
Well, it’s exciting for us to see Lutheran Bible translators jump in both feet and just be a part of it, because there’s life, there’s egos, there’s all those kind of things. There’s reasons to be separate and all that stuff. But as resource partners, we’re very excited and honored. That Lutheran Bible translator says, hey, we’re all in. Here’s our resources, here’s our tools. Yes, if we build a tool together, let’s share this tool. So it’s been exciting to see the strength of everybody come together, which makes us all even stronger. 

29:20
Emily Wilson
So a question that I really have for you, Mart, is because I’m assuming it’s been more than just Guatemala that you’ve traveled to now and that you’ve been working with partners all around the world. So what would you think that the american church could learn from some of the people that you’ve spent time with and in the majority world christian church? 

29:43
Mark Green
Yeah. Thanks, Emily. Yeah, I have traveled several different places. I got to go to another dedication. This dedication actually was with the Lutheran Bible translators in Zambia in 2016. And so it was a very different experience. You go with high expectations and all that. And so here’s what you’re expecting. The dedication was a little bit different in that the first speakers talked about the government officials and all that, and I’m like, no, the heroes of the translators. Start talking about the translators, talk about the translators. I don’t want to hear about those guys. But it was proper, and that was their culture, and it’s their dedication, not mine. Finally, one of the last speakers who’s a female, because they’re all male speakers, finally female. Her name is unique, which I love her name because she was a unique age, she was a unique person. 

30:23
Mark Green
Unique, who’s an Insynca translator, helped, was part of the process. She gets up there, and she thanks everybody. She thanks the translators, the people. I mean, she thanked all my heroes, right? And then she looked at us because there’s a group of funders there, and she looked at us and says, oh, and I want to say thank you to the funders. Because of you, all of my people can now go to heaven, man. It’s just one of those moments that, you know, you’re doing this and you’re doing this work and you’re doing all you can, but for somebody to state it in such a way now, obviously they have to accept Christ and all that stuff, but just say, oh, yeah, that’s what I’m doing. I’m helping people get a chance to go to heaven. 

30:59
Mark Green
And so to realize that Bible translation is so important for those who don’t have it. And we take it for granted, obviously, here in America, because we’ve never had to wait for it. So, anyway, that was another incredible experience I had, and I’m grateful for Lutheran Bible translators being one of the partners of that translation, to be able to be there with them as they celebrated. And just to see the know, I think for us to remember that Christianity is not about a Drudgery. It’s not an obligation. My goodness, this is about joy. This is about life. This is about where life has at. This is in the beginning, God created us. And so I think the joy of the Lord I just saw on the people. 

31:33
Mark Green
And the other thing is sometimes you get in this mentality, or I do as a resource partner. It’s kind of, we’re the resource partner and you’re the receiver. But that’s not true. We’re all givers. We all can be generous with different things. We have talents, we have time. We have relationships to see the relationships. We live in homes we go in our garages, the garages go down. We don’t even know our neighbors near as well, but that can’t happen in many of these foreign countries. They live. And I have something, you have something. And so we’re there. We’re neighbors. And so the neighboring, which I think, obviously, Covid, taught us a little bit. Right. I’m getting to know my neighbors better again, to be honest with you, because I’m not traveling as much, and I’m walking my neighborhood a little bit more. 

32:07
Mark Green
And so I’ve got to meet some neighbors that I’d kind of lost contact with. So I think we can learn that relationships are really important, and I can be more incarnational to my neighbors than I can to the Nsinga. Now, I was able to help the Nsinga by paying for the printing of a translation, all right. But I can do a whole lot more for my neighbor when they need something for me. And so, matter of fact, I’ve started praying for my neighbors by name. I got all my neighbors, I got a list. And so there’s 70 neighbors in my neighborhood and I’m a runner. And so I got a tape recording, and I tape them so every 8 seconds or so when I go in front of their house, their name. 

32:42
Rich Rudowske
Yeah, that’s a level of organization. 

32:44
Mark Green
So sure enough, the other day, here’s my neighbor out, his name’s Glenn. I knew Glenn. I say, hey, Glenn, how’s it doing? He says, fine. He said, oh, by the way, you mind praying for my know and stuff like that? So I was honored. So I’ve been able to email him, hey, how’s Virgil? How’s your dad doing? What’s that? But I’m just assuming now that God’s going to use me, so I’m ready, right? Minister to my neighbors. But that’s a lesson that I’m learning. And to see this in these other countries that I’ve been to, that being a good neighbor, building those relationships locally is really important as well as obviously missions, we need international, we do all that kind of stuff. But there’s your Judea, Jerusalem, and to the ends of the. 

33:20
Emily Wilson
Absolutely. I mean, Jesus commission that it starts off right in their own neighborhoods, being able to be a witness to our community and then trusting that he is going to be working out and it’s a beautiful ripple effect. And seeing how God’s mission isn’t over there, it’s everywhere. And how we might be able to strengthen one another. Awesome. 

33:44
Rich Rudowske
Yeah, I’m going to go a little off script here, but I read an article recently where the author mentioned that in the United States and the christian church, he said that there exists a dangerous biblical illiteracy where people just know enough to be dangerous essentially, is what he was saying. And so you mentioned that you just recently celebrated a commitment to 23 years of reading the Bible every day. Just tell us a little bit more about the role of the Bible in your life and why that level of engagement is important to you or how that’s had an impact in your life. 

34:19
Mark Green
Yeah, again, the Bible was important to my life, but it went to a new level and stuff, kind of an all in level after I saw Gaspar weeping over it and just realized this is the most important thing. And so, yeah, I think it’s an all in calling Christ says, follow me. Stuff like that. So some people want to just have a Sunday faith and live the american dream the rest of the week, which the american dream is not going to make you happy. The data shows that income has gone up. People don’t get happier if you have food, clothing and shelter. Happiness level doesn’t change much. It’s about relationships. It’s about people. It’s a relationship with God first, with ourselves, understanding who we are with others. And so I think, as we get that relationship, but that’s what God’s word is all about. 

35:02
Mark Green
And so each morning I start with psalms one, nine and 18, and I pray that I say, open my eyes, that I may see wonderful things in your law, because it’s a wonderful book. Psalms 119 24 says, give me insight so I can do what you tell me so my whole life. Give me one long, obedient response. And then I pray James four and eight, which is, draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. And then I just call it my oioi. Open insight. Obey intimacy. So those are the things that I’m praying for him. Open insight. Then I’ll obey, and then I’ll draw to us, to intimacy. And so I just start with prayer and read God’s word and just trust that he’ll give new revelation. I mean, I’ve read the same verse ten times today, or whatever. 

35:45
Mark Green
I read that verse. I’m like, oh, wow, I never saw it that way. Maybe I read a different translation sometimes. I like to compare translations. We got that advantage in America. We can compare translation. But like I say, this book is alive. And so if this book is alive, it’s the only book that I can say that about is God’s word. Then there’s so much I can benefit from it and such joy and hope, peace that God gives us. 

36:09
Rich Rudowske
Yeah, if you really think of it, a book that is communication from the creator and redeemer of the world available to you. It seems like a great opportunity to spend your time in a really meaningful way. 

36:22
Emily Wilson
So how can we be praying for you and for the illuminations movement? 

36:28
Mark Green
Well, for me, personally, you can pray for me as a father, a husband, and a grandfather. I mean, that’s my first role, is to be the husband of my wife. I’ve only made two vows to the Lord. One, to die in it till death do his part, and two, to get up first thing and God’s word. And I just celebrated 39 years with my wife in January. And so I’ve been faithful to that. But I always need the prayer of wisdom and how to do that. I’ve got four children. They’re all married now. We have eleven grandchildren with our twelveth coming in April. So what’s my role to help my children and my grandchildren on the illumination side, we actually have a prayer. And so I’m always encouraging people to prayer. It’s a six line prayer and the prayer is God. 

37:04
Mark Green
Your word is more precious than all that I possess. Your scripture gives light to my path and directs my steps. Through your will alone, lives are transformed to minds made new. So I now pray for all people that do not yet know you. For you’ve promised that your voice by every tribe and nation will be heard. So equip us by your breath to provide every heart language with your word. Amen. 

37:27
Rich Rudowske
Amen. 

37:28
Mark Green
So I encourage all, everybody can pray, right? Everybody can be a part. And so prayer is the one thing we all can do. And so if people want to be a part of praying, that’s a six line prayer. Obviously, you can pray whatever you want to pray, but that’s a six line prayer. We’re trying to bombard heaven with that prayer. Maybe heaven will get tired of it and say, just let’s go answer that one. That one’s coming up from. 

37:47
Rich Rudowske
So anyway, that’s awesome. We’ve been talking with Mark Green, ministry investment officer with hobby lobby and steering committee member for the illuminations Bible or the illuminations alliance of Bible translation. Thanks so much for spending your time with us this morning. 

38:02
Mark Green
Thank you, Rich. Emily, I had a great time. 

38:08
Rich Rudowske
Wow, what a blast to talk to Mart this morning. He definitely has a lot of energy, first thing, doesn’t he? 

38:12
Emily Wilson
Oh, my goodness. I know it’s wrong to envy, but that was like, I just want to bottle that energy and all of the enthusiasm and all of the gift that he has, too, of being able to be in community and being intentional. And I just love how much he has a heart for the work of Bible translation, but also the word being in the hands of people so that lives can be transformed. I mean, it’s just awesome. 

38:42
Rich Rudowske
And just his awe and respect for the folks that are on the ground doing the work. These are the heroes. His role, he feels, is small to equip and to help folks that have access to the resources they need to do that. But for him, these are the heroes out there. 

38:56
Emily Wilson
I love it. 

38:57
Rich Rudowske
Yeah. So we do encourage you, if you want to see a little bit more about the Illuminations alliance, do check out Illuminations Bible and scroll around in there. Learn a little bit more. Lutheran Bible translators is proud to be one of the member organizations of the Illuminations alliance, and if you have any comments or questions about the episode, please be sure to send those to us at info@lbt.org or if you’re listening on any of the podcast platforms we’re on, go ahead and subscribe to those first of all, just to take care of that business. And we love to see a rating or comments from you on those platforms as well. Thank you for listening to the essentially translatable podcast brought to you by Lutheran Bible translators. Look for past episodes of the podcast@lbt.org slash podcast, or subscribe wherever you get your podcast content. 

39:45
Rich Rudowske
Follow Lutheran Bible translators social media channels on Facebook, Instagram or Twitter. Or go to lbt.org to find out how you can get involved in the Bible translation movement and put God’s word in their hands. The essentially translatable podcast is produced and edited by Andrew Olson and distributed by Sarah Lyons. Our executive producer is Emily Wilson. Podcast artwork was designed by Caleb Rotewald. Music written and performed by Rob Weit. I’m Rich Radowski. So long for now.